blues improvising- major vs. minor

[rocker_71]

Yesterday I was messing some blues things.
Normally when improvising I just stick to the minor penatonic scale.
That's what I read in some blues books and so.
But I found out that guys like Howling Wolf and Muddy Waters also use the major scale. Worse (for me): they mix major and minor scales. And it sounds cool too!
Now I am confused.
Is there someone of you guys (girzls?) who can clarify this a bit?
Tanx in advance! You can reply in dutch!

[sash]

Blues and books don't go together. Blues is a feeling which can't be explained in a book even if it had a 1000 pages.

Blues is mostly associated with minor scales but it can be played with major scales too.

I started out as an oldschool Texas blues player, also sticking to only the minor scales and sometimes a major BB King lick, but the last 2 years I've been listening to a lot of different musical styles, played by both old and new artists. I.e: Led Zep, Lenny Kravitz, Doyle Bramhall II, Bad Company, Jimi, Allman Brothers, Free. All these guitarists or guitarists from these bands play rock, but if the old blues things are familiar to you (old BB, T-Bone Walker, Freddie King, Albert King, Robert Johnson) you immediately recognize where their roots are. If rock is played right, it's blues with more amps ;)

I have a great album from the Allman Brothers (Live at the Fillmore). It´s a 2 disc album and I believe only the 1 disc version is available here in the Netherlands. The second disc contains some twenty and thirthy minute jams including the several minute show-off solo's. Duane Allman plays some very cool stuff, all major blues licks but he makes them sound very minorish. That's exactly how Muddy Waters for instance did it.
If you'd like, I could make a copy of the album for you. Just send me a PM or e-mail.

Just keep in mind that blues is a feeling and it can't be taught with books. With the right feeling you can make the most minorish note sound like a very happy major note. The only way to play this is to listen to a lot of old blues guys and try play what the play. Don't get delayed by the Stevie Ray Vaughannabe traffic jam and do your own thing :)

Let me know if you want that album.

Sash

[The Thumb]

I disagree, blues theory can be tought via books, the only thing is that if you want to become a good blues player you have to listen to a lot off different blues styles and artists, and practice even more. But as far as I´m concerned, this goes for any kind of music.

Regarding your question, most blues players do combine (pentatonic) minor and major scales, they even mix them with myxolidian scales, for those nice 9th and 13th notes.

A great example of this kind of playing is T-Bone Walker, if you listen to him you also know where Jimmie Vaughan and to a lesser extent Ronnie Earl are coming from . Try to get your hands on one of his early recordings!

@Sash I also have the double CD Live at the Fillmore, didn´t know it was a collectable?

[sash]

@Sash I also have the double CD Live at the Fillmore, didn´t know it was a collectable?

I just checked the free record shop website and it seems it's now also available here as the 'deluxe edition'. I don't believe the original one is a collectable though. It has always been available in the US.

About those T-Bone recordings: I have the Complete Capital/B&W recordings (3CD's), I could make a copy of those as well. I Also have the first 2 records of BB King on one cd. Just gimme a holler!

[Dirtypool]

Holler here :-) copy's too, copy's too. Let me know the costs :)

[pimmetje]

1. I agree with Sash... just play a lot of blues actively as well as passively.
Skip the SRV-stuff for a while. Go to the roots and see what you can get out of anyone's style.

For a few musts:
- John Lee Hooker - Alone (live)
- Muddy Waters - Muddy 'Mississippi' Waters Live

But this way of learning is a sure-fire way of getting stuck in your own (possibly uninspired) riffing if you haven't got too much blues in you anyway.

2. I agree with the Thumb.
Blues can be lifted to another level with some knowledge other than riffs and feeling. The whole point is the ability to channel this feeling through music... so extra knowledge about music is never wrong. There can be one pitfall however in this case.
If you decide to go the way of "book-knowledge blues", you will have to practice a lot more and really know your stuff. Otherwise it will easily sound even crappier than someone just fucking around on one pentatonic scale.

A good book showing ways to use both major and minor in blues is:
- ultimate play-along blues guitar trax (with Robben Ford, Pedro Wyant, etc.)

I hate the kind of blues played on the cd complementing that book, but it can show you a good way of using the various options in blues.

But.... if I have to choose between both method... just listen a lot of John Lee Hooker, Muddy Waters, Lightnin' Hopkins, Bukka White, Sonny Boy Williamson, Slim Harpo, Billy Boy Arnold, Sonny Terry, Browny McGee, Blind Lemon Jefferson, Robert Johnson, Big Jazz Gillum, T-Bone Walker, Little Walter, Lazy Lester, etc, etc...

[The Thumb]

About those T-Bone recordings: I have the Complete Capital/B&W recordings (3CD's), I could make a copy of those as well. I Also have the first 2 records of BB King on one cd. Just gimme a holler!

I have The Complete Imperial Recordings 1950-1954 (2CD) from T-Bone Walker 8-)

[bert k]

Ik verplaats deze draad naar speeltechniek

[sash]

Holler here :-) copy's too, copy's too. Let me know the costs :)

Just send me a mail. You have my address I believe :)

[alhambra]

Volgens mij kan dit forum nooit bedoelt zijn als centrum voor illegale.




















CD's :-D

http://www.risu.org.ua/images/iconology/holy-triniy01.jpg

[Aca Ilic]

Listen to some recent guitarpieces , don't have to dig that far to Muddy and the rest. Get yourself a Poppa Chubbu's Booty and the beast album and knock yourself off.
mvg
Alex

[Aca Ilic]

Like a "Same old blues" maybe........

[The Thumb]

If you want to learn how to mix minor/major pentatonic and myxolidian scales, I wouldn´t recommend Poppa Chubby....

[Dirtypool]

Maybe Joe Bonamassa, he's awesome

[Aca Ilic]

If you want to learn how to mix minor/major pentatonic and myxolidian scales, I wouldn´t recommend Poppa Chubby....

I didn't said that you only have to listen Poppa chubby to LEARN to combine majors and minors. This was only an example. I think that guy has a great sound and technique combaining those two kinda scales.For someone who wants to learn this mix, "Same old blues" is not that fast kinda blues to play....

[guitarmonk]

In the most regular blues the chords are (If it is in the key A)
A7 - A7 - A7 - A7
D7 - D7 - A7 - A7
E7 - D7 - A7 - A7

On the A7 chords you play A myxolidian,
On the D7 chords you play A dorian,
On the E7 chords you play A major or A myxolidian.

I think this is the way they improvise on blues in jazz mostly.